SM-T started to vibrate??

Squeaky back brake? Hard to control at 30mph/40kph?
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Nordic09
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SM-T started to vibrate??

Post by Nordic09 » Fri Jul 15, 2016 11:49 am

Was on 600 kms travel yesterday with bags and lady. Bike started to vibrate, at the beginning there was small vibration and then increased quite a bit. No special sound or smoke or oil consumption, temp is normal. Increases by rpm, not related to gear. If I accelerate by standing next to bike I don't notice much different.

My first guess is that engine is loose from the frame, close to shifter and side stand I see one thread where nut is missing, that can also be related to center stand, don't know which is it yet.

Called to service and they said also that it can be also balancer shaft.. It is driven 20k, and full service manual, what are the odds? Other possibilities?

Will check engine bolts asap..
KTM SMT 2010 (Rottweiler and map in, secondaries, SAS and O2 off)
Ducati Multistrada S 2011
ex Triumph Street Triple R 2013 (too little torque)
ex Triumph Street Triple R 2011 (stolen)
ex Honda CR125 1989
ex Suzuki RG125 1985
ex Yamaha YZ80 1987

Nordic09
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Re: SM-T started to vibrate??

Post by Nordic09 » Sat Jul 16, 2016 4:01 pm

I tightened the triangular motor attacment points from front. All were loose. Much better. Thread wo nut, below the motor is indeed motor attacment, and needs to be fixed. Unfortunately thread is not in good condition, and bolt needs to be renewed. So most probably this gave the vibrations. Check regularly all bolts, I found about 20 other loose bolts (8mm socket) from motor. Actually, only maybe 4 visible bolts were not loose. :D :D :D I came from 3 cylinder street triple and all this is new experience..
KTM SMT 2010 (Rottweiler and map in, secondaries, SAS and O2 off)
Ducati Multistrada S 2011
ex Triumph Street Triple R 2013 (too little torque)
ex Triumph Street Triple R 2011 (stolen)
ex Honda CR125 1989
ex Suzuki RG125 1985
ex Yamaha YZ80 1987

Nordic09
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Re: SM-T started to vibrate??

Post by Nordic09 » Thu Jul 21, 2016 5:47 pm

All bolts were tightened and everything was looking to be ok, at least when riding solo. Today first trip 2up, and the vibration is back from 80 kmh. After riding further, motor vibrates also when accelerating wo gear.

Motor bolts were not 100% tight anymore. What can cause heavy vibration when ridden 2 up? I noticed that rear sprocket rotates by hand app 1 cm. Maybe the internal rubbers are worn out? Can it be drive shaft bearing. Is it possible that bike heats up during one hour and that increases skowly vibrations. Frame was quite hot after ride
KTM SMT 2010 (Rottweiler and map in, secondaries, SAS and O2 off)
Ducati Multistrada S 2011
ex Triumph Street Triple R 2013 (too little torque)
ex Triumph Street Triple R 2011 (stolen)
ex Honda CR125 1989
ex Suzuki RG125 1985
ex Yamaha YZ80 1987

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Re: SM-T started to vibrate??

Post by Muppet » Thu Jul 21, 2016 8:19 pm

Nordic09 wrote: I noticed that rear sprocket rotates by hand app 1 cm.
This. This is your problem. I'm worried about mine moving less than 1 mm and thinking of changing the cush rubbers, are you sure yours is moving 1cm? That's a hell of a lot of movement, you need to get them changed straightaway.
This is what I do with mine....

http://www.bikersoracletours.com

Nordic09
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Re: SM-T started to vibrate??

Post by Nordic09 » Fri Jul 22, 2016 3:37 pm

Ordered new set of rubbers, will change those as first step. Let's hope there is nothing else additionally. When rotating sprocket by hand I feel click and click on both ends (tooth movement app 6 mm), so I think there is zero rubber damping, and metal faces metal.
KTM SMT 2010 (Rottweiler and map in, secondaries, SAS and O2 off)
Ducati Multistrada S 2011
ex Triumph Street Triple R 2013 (too little torque)
ex Triumph Street Triple R 2011 (stolen)
ex Honda CR125 1989
ex Suzuki RG125 1985
ex Yamaha YZ80 1987

Nordic09
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Re: SM-T started to vibrate??

Post by Nordic09 » Mon Jul 25, 2016 8:45 pm

Continuoing the root cause analysis, probably:

Chain was a tad too tight for 2 up riding with bags (10mm clearance), this gave stress to motor bolts, and to sprocket cush. Cush was already warn out, and gave even more vibration to bike and motor connections.

Yesterday when riding slowly at city, I noticed that actually, after motor heats up, it starts to run very rough. I was using low rpm due to cush problem. Then I performed 15 min, idle and at least straigh after the bike was smooth, have to see if it really affected. Can this be due to that I changed from 98e to 95e fuel? Some other proposals? It is std map..
KTM SMT 2010 (Rottweiler and map in, secondaries, SAS and O2 off)
Ducati Multistrada S 2011
ex Triumph Street Triple R 2013 (too little torque)
ex Triumph Street Triple R 2011 (stolen)
ex Honda CR125 1989
ex Suzuki RG125 1985
ex Yamaha YZ80 1987

Nordic09
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Posts: 75
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Re: SM-T started to vibrate??

Post by Nordic09 » Thu Jul 28, 2016 6:35 pm

Cush changed and it did help. Probably need to change the sprocket bolts as well.

Tried to shake front sprocket by hand and there is just small movement as I was afraid of. How difficult is to change the bearing to drive shaft? Or expensive if mechanic does it? Guess you can do it from outside?

Up-date: when riding faster it still vibrates a lot. Motor is not loose anymore and cush is good. I'm getting really worried, what can cause heavy vibration to engine. Increases gradually after 4500 rpm. It is heavy vibration and also when clutch pressed..
KTM SMT 2010 (Rottweiler and map in, secondaries, SAS and O2 off)
Ducati Multistrada S 2011
ex Triumph Street Triple R 2013 (too little torque)
ex Triumph Street Triple R 2011 (stolen)
ex Honda CR125 1989
ex Suzuki RG125 1985
ex Yamaha YZ80 1987

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Re: SM-T started to vibrate??

Post by Magic Wand » Sat Jul 30, 2016 6:29 pm

Hey Helsinki man!

Take off the front sprocket and then try to move the shaft up and down. There should be NO PLAY at all!

This is a picture of the bearing inside the shaft seal ring. I don´t think you are able to take it out from outside...
IMG_2041.jpg
/M

Nordic09
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Re: SM-T started to vibrate??

Post by Nordic09 » Tue Aug 02, 2016 8:25 pm

Ok, thx!

I think that finally found the problem: opened clutch cover yesterday evening and found 3 bolts which were not tight. After torqueing those, vibration was less but not perfect. Then I thought that maybe clutch center nut is loose and opened clutch again: nut was not loose. Then built the clutch head and gradually tightened all 6 bolts to 10 Nm. Now it works. It seems that if some clutch bolts are loose, you have to open also the rest and then tighten those evenly..

Anyway I think that all other problems (engine bolts, clutch bolts) were born from the worn out cush and a bit too tight chain. Cush condition is easy to detect by rotating rear sprocket by hand when gear is not on. Now there is zero play.
KTM SMT 2010 (Rottweiler and map in, secondaries, SAS and O2 off)
Ducati Multistrada S 2011
ex Triumph Street Triple R 2013 (too little torque)
ex Triumph Street Triple R 2011 (stolen)
ex Honda CR125 1989
ex Suzuki RG125 1985
ex Yamaha YZ80 1987

Nordic09
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Posts: 75
Joined: Sat Jun 04, 2016 10:32 pm
Country: Finland
City: Helsinki
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Re: SM-T started to vibrate??

Post by Nordic09 » Tue Aug 09, 2016 6:03 pm

Some Vibration is still there but only when engine is really hot. Took the bike to dealer eventually, and they measured fuel pressure, which was ok. Also the error codes were read and no problems there.

Next step will be tune ecu cable, and new map, I'm certain that it runs lean when hot. Since it was used and didn't ride so much before other problems, it might be that it was like that when I bought it.
KTM SMT 2010 (Rottweiler and map in, secondaries, SAS and O2 off)
Ducati Multistrada S 2011
ex Triumph Street Triple R 2013 (too little torque)
ex Triumph Street Triple R 2011 (stolen)
ex Honda CR125 1989
ex Suzuki RG125 1985
ex Yamaha YZ80 1987

Nordic09
250cc
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Posts: 75
Joined: Sat Jun 04, 2016 10:32 pm
Country: Finland
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Re: SM-T started to vibrate??

Post by Nordic09 » Thu Aug 25, 2016 4:58 pm

Got the cable and loaded the kev's smoothened std map. Problem solved, pulls better by wider range down low and middle and feels like new bike with all other fixes done down the road. Vibrates much less. Well it was good that also fixed those other starting problems regarding loose clutch and motor bolts and even broken steering bearing. Best bike ever now :D
KTM SMT 2010 (Rottweiler and map in, secondaries, SAS and O2 off)
Ducati Multistrada S 2011
ex Triumph Street Triple R 2013 (too little torque)
ex Triumph Street Triple R 2011 (stolen)
ex Honda CR125 1989
ex Suzuki RG125 1985
ex Yamaha YZ80 1987

Nordic09
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Re: SM-T started to vibrate??

Post by Nordic09 » Tue Sep 13, 2016 6:46 pm

Continual of this active discussion: eventually changed also the fuel filter. It helped clearly down low and pulls much better and smooth from 3000 rpm, now it is possibly to ride 85 kmh with 6th. When I purchased this with all above mentioned problems, couldn't use 6th under 105 kmh.

KTM dealers, 2 different couldn't help with problems. Only they said that check engine bolts, and that c'mon it is twin and it should vibrate..
KTM SMT 2010 (Rottweiler and map in, secondaries, SAS and O2 off)
Ducati Multistrada S 2011
ex Triumph Street Triple R 2013 (too little torque)
ex Triumph Street Triple R 2011 (stolen)
ex Honda CR125 1989
ex Suzuki RG125 1985
ex Yamaha YZ80 1987

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Re: SM-T started to vibrate??

Post by Muppet » Tue Sep 13, 2016 9:03 pm

Nordic09 wrote:Continual of this active discussion: eventually changed also the fuel filter. It helped clearly down low and pulls much better and smooth from 3000 rpm, now it is possibly to ride 85 kmh with 6th. When I purchased this with all above mentioned problems, couldn't use 6th under 105 kmh.

KTM dealers, 2 different couldn't help with problems. Only they said that check engine bolts, and that c'mon it is twin and it should vibrate..
Something still not right here. On a light throttle, I can ride my bike down to 30mph - 50kph in 6th gear. It chugs a little, and vibrates a little, but pulls cleanly and without hesitation. The only mods it has to the engine are, well, none! I have a pair of Fuel exhausts, standard headers, no change in map, no change to intakes, nothing else. All I did was a 15 minute idle reset after putting the cans on, and it's been much smoother since.
This is what I do with mine....

http://www.bikersoracletours.com

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Re: SM-T started to vibrate??

Post by Nordic09 » Tue Sep 13, 2016 9:08 pm

C'mon!! :D

Well then I'll do the throttle bodies sync on winter. Is your bike stock, with acra's and -1 for example.
KTM SMT 2010 (Rottweiler and map in, secondaries, SAS and O2 off)
Ducati Multistrada S 2011
ex Triumph Street Triple R 2013 (too little torque)
ex Triumph Street Triple R 2011 (stolen)
ex Honda CR125 1989
ex Suzuki RG125 1985
ex Yamaha YZ80 1987

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Re: SM-T started to vibrate??

Post by Muppet » Wed Sep 14, 2016 11:27 pm

Nordic09 wrote:C'mon!! :D

Well then I'll do the throttle bodies sync on winter. Is your bike stock, with acra's and -1 for example.
My bike is completely stock, apart from the Fuel exhaust cans. Nothing else modified from standard (well, the screen, but that doesn't count).

It smoothed out a lot after adding the cans and doing the 15 minute idle reset. No fancy maps, air intakes, filters, nothing, just the cans and a reset. Never synced it, never tried any of the other fixes, I may just be lucky, or I'm too insensitive to notice, but for me it's fine.
This is what I do with mine....

http://www.bikersoracletours.com

Nordic09
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Re: SM-T started to vibrate??

Post by Nordic09 » Tue Sep 27, 2016 8:37 pm

Tune ecu showed slight diff in throttle bodies, but not very much, will adjust it after I remove secondaries and change the rc8 intake pipe. Actually it is still vibrating somewhat (not very irritating) on 6th and from 120 kmh. It can be also worn out chains and sprockets.. or maybe ktm exhaust causes turbulence and vibration.
KTM SMT 2010 (Rottweiler and map in, secondaries, SAS and O2 off)
Ducati Multistrada S 2011
ex Triumph Street Triple R 2013 (too little torque)
ex Triumph Street Triple R 2011 (stolen)
ex Honda CR125 1989
ex Suzuki RG125 1985
ex Yamaha YZ80 1987

Nordic09
250cc
250cc
Posts: 75
Joined: Sat Jun 04, 2016 10:32 pm
Country: Finland
City: Helsinki
Year: 2011
Model: SMT

Re: SM-T started to vibrate??

Post by Nordic09 » Mon Oct 03, 2016 7:51 pm

Throttle bodies sync done with tune ecu (very easy), 2ndaries removed, rc8 stack to front cylinder, Rottweiler installed, map no. 20 in, but with SAS, and std exhaust. Very good and smooth, pulls from 3200 rpm and does not vibrate. At low speed even 2500 rpm is ok to ride at city. At high end the stock exhaust clearly hinders revving, but otherwise it is perfect, and no comparable to std bike. Pulls like hell from low down.
KTM SMT 2010 (Rottweiler and map in, secondaries, SAS and O2 off)
Ducati Multistrada S 2011
ex Triumph Street Triple R 2013 (too little torque)
ex Triumph Street Triple R 2011 (stolen)
ex Honda CR125 1989
ex Suzuki RG125 1985
ex Yamaha YZ80 1987

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