Engine runs badly at 5000-5500 on 6th.

Squeaky back brake? Hard to control at 30mph/40kph?
Don
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Engine runs badly at 5000-5500 on 6th.

Post by Don » Tue Oct 11, 2011 7:58 pm

Sorry if the following was discussed already, I could not find it. Sorry also for my English.

My SMT has 1000 km, I have just done the first tuning. Standard exhaust system.

I did a trip with my wife which included highway. Here we ride 130-150 kmh, which correspond to 5000-5500 rpm of the engine. At 5000 the torque decreases noticeably, and more important the vibrations start, very very strong. I have had several big twins, but none with a "hole" in the progression like this (not to mention the "self-destruction" vibrations).

Has enyone had the same experience? In case, does it disappear remapping and using Akra (for instance)?
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Re: Engine runs badly at 5000-5500 on 6th.

Post by Rangoonruns » Tue Oct 11, 2011 8:59 pm

Get your bike checked at dealer i have heard nothing about this

you could try the 15 minute idle reset trick to see if that helps?

sorry can not be more helpfull
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Re: Engine runs badly at 5000-5500 on 6th.

Post by dancerdave » Tue Oct 11, 2011 11:02 pm

Haven't heard of this before Don, and I don't think there are any posts here about it. Your bike is under warranty so let the dealer sort it out
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Re: Engine runs badly at 5000-5500 on 6th.

Post by Marcelo » Wed Oct 12, 2011 12:51 am

these vib effects happens whith me too togheter my fiance . Just alone no vib effects on the road. Testing 16t sprocket and runing in 6k sounds good

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Re: Engine runs badly at 5000-5500 on 6th.

Post by k1973 » Wed Oct 12, 2011 1:01 am

I had a similar experience with mine when loaded for an extended trip. I left for my trip with 1200 miles on the odometer and had not experienced the issue. When loaded, the bike did not like anything under 5k when in 6th gear. So I either had to keep it above 80mph or drop down a gear.

However, after a few thousand miles the engine started to break in and really started to smooth out and the issue became less apparent. Not saying the issue is completely gone, but I have not noticed it as much. Now that I'm back from my trip I plan on trying to duplicate the issue and if its still there then I'll be taking it to the dealer.
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Re: Engine runs badly at 5000-5500 on 6th.

Post by Poucher56 » Wed Oct 12, 2011 5:59 pm

Just a thought Don, your chain could tighten up too much with the extra weight of your fiance on board, but ok with only you solo, this could explain the vibes but not the hole in power delivery :?:

Check your chain tension 2-up is not too tight

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Re: Engine runs badly at 5000-5500 on 6th.

Post by Don » Wed Oct 12, 2011 6:29 pm

Well, I got the bike back from dealer. Believe it or not, he said:
- The tires had pressure too low; (But I got the bike from them, brand new, 4 days earlier...)
- The chain was too loose; (see above)
- The engine runs ok; :shock:
- They set the suspensions to "comfort" to diminish the perception of vibs. :shock:

Simply, I could not believe it. I will now get in touch with KTM Italy.

Two side comments:
- the setting "comfort" is either to use a fraction of the potential the bike, or to do off-road... (I had asked to set "sport" - the bike was on "standard")
- Me + my wife = 125 kg!

My entrance into the KTM world has not started under good auspices...
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Re: Engine runs badly at 5000-5500 on 6th.

Post by Samppa2005 » Wed Oct 12, 2011 6:58 pm

My -08 990 sm vibrated for the first 20 000 km around 5000 rpm. After that it has smoothed down. For me it was just that the engine vibrated at that specific rpm and caused vibrations in the pegs and bars. Couldn't ride for long with that 5000 without my hands going numb. I got a 16T front sprocket which shifted the rpm range that i didn't have to ride at those rpm. Also rode deliberately at that rpm for a while which helped smoothen it. Didn't blow up so far :-) If your previous bikes have been Japanese owning a KTM will be quite a different world. Every now and then i have to pull a video from youtube or somewhere to hear what someone else's engine sounds like because mine makes such a racket. Even in the videos they all sound like they had rocks in them.

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Re: Engine runs badly at 5000-5500 on 6th.

Post by Rangoonruns » Thu Oct 13, 2011 1:08 pm

Don first off 125kg for you and wife = need more pasta :D :D :D

secondly, you will want the bike set for sport if doing 2 up riding, comfort will be too soft.

check chain = i agree with this point

Also when you are cruisin in 6th gear if it is vibey (remember its a twin) try changing down to 5th gear and see if it smooths out, it may just be that it is struggling??

but do try the 15 min reset as you have fitted new cans

cheers john
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Re: Engine runs badly at 5000-5500 on 6th.

Post by Don » Thu Oct 13, 2011 4:42 pm

Rangoonruns wrote:Don first off 125kg for you and wife = need more pasta :D :D :D
Better not, on 6th it is a problems already even with these weigths to carry around... :cry:
secondly, you will want the bike set for sport if doing 2 up riding, comfort will be too soft.
sure, I asked the dealer to set it sport, he decided without asking to put it comfort (which is no good not even for one person)
Also when you are cruisin in 6th gear if it is vibey (remember its a twin) try changing down to 5th gear and see if it smooths out, it may just be that it is struggling??
Almost no problem in 5th, but in 6th it does it even if am riding solo
but do try the 15 min reset as you have fitted new cans
No I still have the standard cans (will go to Akra during winter...)
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Re: Engine runs badly at 5000-5500 on 6th.

Post by Rangoonruns » Thu Oct 13, 2011 8:48 pm

Don

check your chain tension i run about 7mm from top of chain to underside of the swingarm when bike is on side stand, after this i am definately struggling to come up with any reasons for the bad vibes

wish i could help you more

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Re: Engine runs badly at 5000-5500 on 6th.

Post by ultrachrome » Thu Oct 13, 2011 9:47 pm

I don't typically cruise at 5k but when I have the bike is more vibey in that range but not enough to concern me. However, I test rode a 2010 Adventure and it had horrible vibes in the 5k range. Bad enough to not buy it. Neither the 2010 nor 2011 SMT demos exhibited this. This Adventure demo had just about every part from the hard parts catalog including Akro's so I just chalked it up as being an ECU mapping issue.

After you fit new cans, I suggest taking it to a professional tuner for remapping. I thought I read the bike is very lean around 5k for Euro emissions compliance. Another member pointed out an MCN article that is getting me thinking about doing this myself.

BSD Performance's Account of MCN SMT Remap

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Re: Engine runs badly at 5000-5500 on 6th.

Post by White Knight » Thu Oct 13, 2011 10:43 pm

Try a 16 tooth front sprocket. I'll bet all your woes will be cured!
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Re: Engine runs badly at 5000-5500 on 6th.

Post by Bootworks » Fri Oct 14, 2011 2:58 am

This is absolutely not how a 2011 SMT should behave. I believe you have the right motorcycle, but the wrong technician. Mine is happiest at 5,000rpm and above, that's where she wants to play.

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Re: Engine runs badly at 5000-5500 on 6th.

Post by phanson » Fri Oct 14, 2011 8:21 am

Bootworks wrote:This is absolutely not how a 2011 SMT should behave. I believe you have the right motorcycle, but the wrong technician. Mine is happiest at 5,000rpm and above, that's where she wants to play.

+1

I've had more bother with a smooth running '10my SMT than anyone else I know - BUT from 5k upwards the bike is and always has been smooth, responsive and pulled like crazy. Even more so with pipes and a tune.

Fyi - I've just had the 2nd b'flys opened in the ECU, but left in place. O² sensors and SAS valve likewise switched off but left in place. This means the bike can be reset to standard by any dealer with a simple reflash on the diagnostics confuser. Only the end cans and airbox have been physically changed (the latter needs the filter element replacing plus snorkel and side plates putting back on) - which is a 20-30 minute job I guess?
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Re: Engine runs badly at 5000-5500 on 6th.

Post by Don » Fri Oct 14, 2011 2:03 pm

Thanks, this i very very interesting. To avoid getting the warranty void, here we need to put Akra and have remapping done by an authorized dealer. I meant to do that and I will.

I now just need to know if in my bike there is something worse than other SMTs, hence suggesting to contact KTM Italy (the dealer who sold the bike is deleted as possible further option).
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Re: Engine runs badly at 5000-5500 on 6th.

Post by milq » Fri Oct 14, 2011 3:12 pm

My 2010 has a bit of vibes right at 5000rpm as well, when I try to roll through that rpm range in 6th. I don't even touch 6th gear now until 75mph+ and don't have any issues with it. I am leaning towards a 16 tooth sprocket.

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Re: Engine runs badly at 5000-5500 on 6th.

Post by ultrachrome » Fri Oct 14, 2011 9:20 pm

Don wrote: Thanks, this i very very interesting. To avoid getting the warranty void, here we need to put Akra and have remapping done by an authorized dealer. I meant to do that and I will.

I now just need to know if in my bike there is something worse than other SMTs, hence suggesting to contact KTM Italy (the dealer who sold the bike is deleted as possible further option).
Void your warranty? Did your dealer tell you that? Have you sought the opinion of another dealer?

Is it possible to test ride another SMT or SMR in your area? I was lucky in that the dealer had both 2010 and 2011 SMTs on the floor as well as a 2010 ADV. I rode them all back to back.

Do you have to use the Akra's with the catalytic converter (62005099100)?

I sent that article to a local tuner who just replied that he could do that. Price seems good. $175 if the cylinders are balanced or $225 to tune the cylinders separately. Currently debating whether I want to do this with the stock silencers buy aftermarket silencers. I'd prefer to keep the bike quiet as to avoid unnecessary attention.

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Re: Engine runs badly at 5000-5500 on 6th.

Post by Stinkerbelle » Sat Oct 15, 2011 1:56 pm

I find the 990 in the SMT is quite picky about (approaching) full throttle acceleration and gets quite 'vibey' at 5000rpm and below; certainly the tune is nowhere near as forgiving as my 950Adv. As the internals are as near as the same, I can only assume that it is down to fuelling tune.

I am quite happy to ride around the issue (not really a problem - just drop it to 5th to pick up the pace or ride at more than 80mph (130kph) and don't worry too much.

The 950 Adv will pull nicely fro 2500 rpm... nowhere near as aggressive as the SMT though :twisted:
Cheers,

Dave


Not a cynic... I just wish it was better:-(

The SMT is Black - the profile drop down doesn't let me put that in!

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Re: Engine runs badly at 5000-5500 on 6th.

Post by Don » Sat Mar 24, 2012 5:21 am

UPDATE

Akra (no cat) and remapping fixed it all...
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